In this Get Emergent Podcast, Bill and Jeremiah explore the role of fear in leadership. From the fear of failure to the fear of losing trust or feeling isolated, leaders face challenges that can either hold them back or propel them forward. This episode offers insights on how to reframe fear as a resource for growth, resilience, and stronger connections.
Prefer to read the transcript?
*Note: The following text is the output of transcribing from an audio recording. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors.
Bill Berthel
Welcome to the Get Emergent Podcast. The Get Emergent Podcast guides leaders to creatively strengthen relationships and improve performance of their leadership and those they lead. We like to provide concepts and ideas that you can turn into pragmatic experiments to help you develop your higher potential in your work and leadership. Hopefully, you’ll find some better practices to apply in your own work. I’m Bill Berthel.
Jeremiah Poulsen
And I’m Jeremiah Poulsen.
Bill Berthel
Jeremiah, in the spirit of autumn and October, Halloween’s coming up. We’re going to do some scary leadership stories.
Jeremiah Poulsen
Looking forward to it. I’ve got to tell you, Bill, my neighbor down the street is a full-throttle Halloween decorator. The whole corner of the neighborhood has all kinds of things. And every time I walk by, he’s got this dog that jumps out of a little dog house. I know it’s there, but every time I walk by it jumps out, makes noise, and still scares me.
Bill Berthel
That’s awesome.
Leaders need to step into their fear and be aware of it
Bill Berthel
We were talking earlier about the idea of projection of fear. You know that dog isn’t real, but there’s still a projection of fear that you bring. Fear is a normal human thing to have. We’re not suggesting everybody be fearless. Leaders need to step into their fear and be aware of it. Be more conscious of where we’re projecting our fear and what might be projecting fear for us.
Jeremiah Poulsen
Being conscious of it means I can see it, feel it, and allow it to teach me. I want to know what that fear is telling me. It might be purely imaginary, or it might be signaling something important I need to be aware of.
Bill Berthel
Absolutely. Fear can hold us back and keep us playing small. But fear can also be resourceful. Sometimes it keeps us safe or helps us avoid overextending. In leadership, fear often shows up as fear of failure.
Jeremiah Poulsen
Nobody goes into something hoping to fail.
Bill Berthel
Right. But more sophisticated leaders understand failure is a learning opportunity. They’re less fearful and more open to trying. For me, the fear of failure held me back at times in my leadership career.
Jeremiah Poulsen
Yeah. It happens often. Fear freezes you up, keeps you from moving forward, from trying something new, or from taking a risk. But reframing it helps. Perseverance includes reframing failure as a learning opportunity and then trying again.
Bill Berthel
Exactly. Every failure can bring new questions or possible pathways. It shifts from fear to discovery. When I worked on developing a safe alternative to Venetian plaster, it took over three and a half years of repeated failure before we found success. Fear was always there, but so was learning.
Jeremiah Poulsen
And reframing failure as normal and useful creates continuous improvement. That’s what leads to higher-level performance.
Fear of losing trust with others can paralyze people in difficult situations
Jeremiah Poulsen
I’ve also experienced the fear of losing trust and relationships. As a young welder, I left a job without telling my foreman. I was too afraid of disappointing him. That silence cost me respect anyway. Luckily, a friend helped me have the missing conversation. It showed me how fear can paralyze if we let it.
Bill Berthel
We see that often. Leaders avoid conversations because they’re afraid of harming relationships. But those missing conversations cost us more than having them.
Third fear for many leaders is fear of isolation
Bill Berthel
Another fear leaders face is isolation. Leadership can feel lonely, especially when making difficult or unpopular decisions.
Jeremiah Poulsen
Right. The fear of isolation threatens our need for comfort and community. Leaders wonder if they’ll still have support when they make tough calls. But reflecting on what’s really threatened helps put fear in perspective.
Bill Berthel
Exactly. The antidote is connection, clear communication, and inviting others into the process. Psychological safety makes it easier to face fear.
Jeremiah Poulsen
And before connection, reflection is key. Leaders need to pause and ask themselves, what am I afraid of? Why am I avoiding this conversation? That reflection shifts fear into awareness.
Bill Berthel
Yes. It’s like seeing your neighbor’s dog jump out. You slow down and prepare. Reflection allows us to face fear differently.
Jeremiah Poulsen
And often we realize, even if the worst happens, we’ll still be okay and will learn from it.
What are you afraid of, leaders? We love to hear about it
Bill Berthel
So we’d like to challenge our listeners: spend this October reflecting on what fears might be holding you back in leadership. Take a proactive step to lean into them.
Jeremiah Poulsen
Yes. What are you afraid of, leaders? We’d love to hear about it.
Bill Berthel
We know you’re out there listening. Thank you for joining us. We hope you enjoyed this episode and look forward to more. You can listen to new episodes twice a month here at Get Emergent or wherever you listen to podcasts. And if you apply something you learned, let us know how it goes by reaching out to [email protected].
Jeremiah Poulsen
Thanks, everyone.
Comments (0)